RE: LOGO-L> submission of kids creations to logo-l

[RAY CATZEL <learn@computerpals.on.ca>]

Hi Oscar,
Your approach to introducing logo is most interesting - especially how you 
related what was happening on the computer to the kids' real world.  A couple 
of comments from my own experience:

I have found (like others on this list) that the kids love to play act as if 
they were a turtle (or a robot). Even 5 year olds can participate.
If you use Microworlds, using buttons to execute commands is easy for them to 
follow.  At this stage it does not matter that the screen gets cluttered with 
buttons. It has value because each button's command is clearly visible and it 
is an easy way to learn a command.
Drawing a square has been well documented and is highly recommended as one of 
the first projects.
Use the buttons to control the movement of the turtle(s). Kids today have been 
spoilt by interactive games and they love the  interactivity of controlling the 
turtle (especially when the turtle is set to move repetitively)
The next phase is the maze. There are such a variety of maze games that one can 
generate. It can be very simple or highly complex, which makes it stimulating 
for all ages. The multimedia capabilities of Microworlds adds a 
state-of-the-art dimension.

I propose we have a competition where kids are encouraged to submit their game 
creations to logo-l. Maybe we can get LCSI to award prizes (free software?) for 
the best creations.

Ray Catzel
President  ComputerPals
Email:  learn@computerpals.on.ca
Internet:  http://www.computerpals.on.ca/~pals



-----Original Message-----
From:	BR1BEO@VMANDINO.VNET.IBM.COM [SMTP:BR1BEO@VMANDINO.VNET.IBM.COM]
Sent:	Thursday, August 14, 1997 11:52 AM
To:	LOGO-L@gsn.org
Subject:	LOGO-L> To Clare Hudson regarding first-5th graders

This is what I usually suggest for first timers:
0. Have them go thru the process that will get the turtle on the screen
   (will vary depending on the version of Logo whether or not you have
   Windows or DOS or W95 machines or Apple, etc.) Once they know how
   to go from machine unplugged and turned off to the turtle in the
   screen have them discuss what they've done with what they usually do
   with other apparatus (Microwave, Nintendo, VCR, TV's). How is it the
   same how is it different.
1. Ask why isn't the turtle doing something? Why the computer is not te-
   lling/suggesting us things to do?
   The idea is to demonstrate machines are not smart, they don't know
   anything, they can't do anything unless a thinking human tells them
   what to do. There are no intelligent machines, just machines which
   show what some intelligent being told them to do. It's our turn.
   A little story about the turtle and ask the students to tell the
   turtle to move forward or backward any number (they have to decide
   how much) writing the full word (this suggestions are for children
   who know how to write). After they do (and press "enter") ask what
   happened, when they tell you their numbers (like 45 50 100,etc.)
   ask them: fifty what? Somebody will answer turtle steps and you may
   discuss the concept of distance and how to measure it, find out about
   the history of lenght measures, why a foot is called a foot, what were
   the better ways to define a "standard" foot (the king's foot lenght,
   the average foot lenght of the kingdom population, of a sample of the
   population, etc.). Find out the "Classroom foot" averaging the whole
   classroom lenghts by drawing their feet side by side on a large piece
   of paperand drawing a straight line covering at a point decided by the
   class. You can take this opportunity to discuss the concept of avera-
   ge, of the arbitrariness of standards. How most people of the world
   decided to define the meter as the 1/10000000 of the lenght of one
   cuadrant of the Earth's meridian and finally as a very large number
   of times the wave lenght of the green light of Kr 86 (not the north
   americans who still use the old english systems of measures). Ask what
   else can be measured (time, temperature, volume, etc.) what are the
   standards in those magnitudes, you can keep oing as long as there is
   interest and participation.
2. Going back to the turtle ask children to tell the turtle to go right
   or left a certain number. Usually they will tell you something is
   wrong because it "didn't move". have them check again, look carefully
   use the "slowturtle" option if your logo has one, so they will learn
   rotation is something else the turtle can do when moving and it will
   not mean it is not moving.
3. Now they know enough to have the turtle do whatever they want, leave
   them alone with the turtle (don't go out of  the class) and tell them
   you are available if it doesn't seem to work propoerly. Questions will
   begin, certainly they will need some more tham forward, backward, left
   and right. How do I move the turtle without leaving a trace? I want
   to erase this part? I want to draw a square? I want a house?, etc. etc
   Answer only those questions that really require a new command, if they
   want to do something that can be done with what they already know cha
   llenge them to think about it and find out, don't tell them what or
   how to do it.
Depending on the age and previous knowledge of children this may take
from an hour to several classes. When they feel comfortable with what
they know suggest them to prepare projects to combine what tehy already
know, don't bring recipes but open ideas. When they want to draw a cir-
cle refrain yourself from giving them the procedure (by the way the
repeat 360(fd 1 rt 1) method is just one form and it doesn't work when
you want a circle of given radius.
Do some projects yourself (with the commands they are using) while they
are working, share them with the group, have them share their ideas, sin
ce they will know different commands (according to their needs) after a
few classes, use some time for them to share their knowledge.
Have them work in groups on proposed 'challenges' offer 'new commands'
or 'tricks' t those who find solutions for the challenges.
I hope the list find it proper to post this in the list, it's the result
of dualiguing with teachers about how to begin with Logo, it can be
extended much more to introduce procedures, text processing, etc.
Hope you find it useful, good luck with your class.
Oscar Becerra
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